Re: Help!: Update Frame for Mac OSX; We Need Your Votes!

["Dmitry Yunov" <yudmi@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

Hi.
In general I agree with Dov.
It is obvious Adobe has two very significant historically  for document
management area Non-Cooltype applications:
1. PageMaker 6.5 and 7
2. FrameMaker/Frame+SGML 6 and next 7

No CoolType engine in an application - no Unicode and OpenType support
No Unicode - no XML
No XML - no new Frame+XSGML 8
No Unicode - no any new languages (Greek, CE or Cyrillic i.e.) support in
these applications
No Unicode - no cross-platform transparent document opening
No OpenType support - no advanced typhography use (ligatures, old style,
capitel) and cross-platform document/font utilization.
And so on.

Carbon/Cocoa requred as least primitive Unicode support in an application .
MacOS X requred it too.
Frame won't become "Carbonized" until it has been rewritten for the
CoolType/AGM model.
Frame 7 is not rewritten for it as it's clear for any person.
Let's wait Frame 8.

I am not interesting in PageMaker 7, I don't need Frame/Frame+SGML 7.

Dmitri Yunov
L10n Expert
yudmi@star.spb.ru

STAR-Group, Russian Department
www.star-group.net

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dov Isaacs" <isaacs@Adobe.COM>
To: "Hays Dennis " <KK7777@dfa.state.ny.us>
Cc: "'Jeff Nailen'" <jeffnailen@earthlink.net>; <framers@frameusers.com>;
<framers@omsys.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2001 4:14 PM
Subject: RE: Help!: Update Frame for Mac OSX; We Need Your Votes!


> NO! No one from Adobe ever said that all of their next whole number
> versions (x.0) are going to be "Carbonized". What we have said, quite
> consistently since the first version of MacOS X was "released" a few
> months back can be found at:
> <http://www.adobe.com/products/adobesupportsOSX.html>
>
> Specifically, you can find information about FrameMaker and MacOS X
> at: <http://www.adobe.com/products/framemaker/framemakerOSX.html>
> There are no plans to carbonize FrameMaker for the next major release.
>
> I might further add that "campaigns" of the type urged below with a
> "Mac fan magazine" will not have any positive effect other to start
> stupid rumors again. And both users of FrameMaker and your friends
> within Adobe need such rumors and media pressure like we need a third
> head.
>
> Lest anybody think that carbonization of an application is trivial,
> let me assure you that it isn't. Adobe has been work on carbonization
> of other applications and our core technologies for well over two
> years now. The carbon specs have been fairly fluid over time and there
> is still not a version of "carbonlib" that actually works well enough
> for Adobe applications to function at a level under MacOS X that evens
> functionality under MacOS 9.x and earlier. If you had a preference,
> would you prefer the "neat and cool" of MacOS X or would you like to
> be able to print?
>
> Plus, the moment you carbonize, you force users of "classic Macs" to
> upgrade to MacOS 9.1 at a minimum. Adobe is working with Apple to try
> to not only fix carbonlib, but add base functionality under MacOS X
> such that it is not PostScript and Type 1/OpenType brain-dead out of
> the box.
>
> So please, do Lee Richardson and team (as well as myself and other
> Adobe employees who monitor these lists) a big favor and "cool your jets"
> on this issue. We know you want FrameMaker native under MacOS X.
> WE want FrameMaker native under MacOS X. Given the timing and resources
> for the next version of FrameMaker AND the amount of work required to
> get carbonization "right" once Apple supplies a working carbonlib and
> OS, getting the next version of FrameMaker carbonized is just not
> in the cards.
>
>         - Dov
>
>
> At 6/28/2001 03:28 AM, Hays, Dennis wrote:
> >Didn't Adobe say that all of their next whole number versions (x.0) are
> >going to be "Carbonized"?
> >
> >Dennis
> >---------------------------------------------
> >Dennis Hays Information Design
> >web: http://www.haysdesign.com
> >mailto:dhays@haysdesign.com
> >Telephone: +1 518.479.4220
> >June 28, 2001  6:28:15 AM
>
> *
>
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Jeff Nailen [mailto:jeffnailen@earthlink.net]
> >Sent: June 27, 2001 10:32 PM
> >To: framers@omsys.com
> >Subject: Help!: Update Frame for Mac OSX; We Need Your Votes!
> >
> >To all Mac Frame users:
> >
> >We need your 'votes'!
> >
> >As you know, a big issue is when or whether Adobe will carbonize or
> >cocoa-ize Frame for the Mac.
> >
> >I've posted a new topic on the Macworld 'Operating Systems' forum asking
> >Macworld to add Frame to its chart of 4 dozen or so 'key applications
being
> >rewritten to run natively in OSX', an ongoing tool they are using to
track
> >developers' progress & announcement dates. The chart is on their home
page.
> >
> >If Frame is added to this chart of 'key' Mac apps (along with several
other
> >higher-profile Adobe products), it will raise Frame's visibility on
Adobe's
> >radar screen, and let Adobe know there are many Mac Frame users who want
> >this update. If they know there's a large demand for this, they may
update
> >sooner than otherwise.
> >
> >If enough people contact Macworld, they may just respond by adding Frame
to
> >their list, so that every time they contact Adobe for an update, Frame
will
> >be included in the inquiry.
> >
> >If Macworld identifies Frame as a 'key' app, perhaps Adobe will recognize
it
> >as such.
> >
> >After just 1 day, we already have 8 replies. We only need 7 more to turn
> >this into a 'hot' topic that will get the Macworld editors' attention.
> >
> >Please, when you get a chance,
> >
> >1) go to www.macworld.com
> >
> >2) click on the 'Forums' tab
> >
> >3) go to the 'Operating Systems' forum
> >
> >4) find the 'Adobe FrameMaker on Road to OSX' topic
> >
> >and register your support. It will only take a couple minutes.
> >
> >Btw, Adobe actively monitors these forums, so you will get double the
bang
> >out of your message!
> >
> >Thanks!
>
>
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